Jennifer: To start… How long have you been involved in hardcore?
Stickman: I got into hardcore around 1984. I was a crossover dude, you know, like a metalhead. I would go to metal shows, and they would have hardcore bands opening up like Sheer Terror, Ludachrist, Leeway, Cro-Mags, and… just seeing these bands, I would go home and research it, and I was really like, “Wow, I like this stuff!” It was how I felt as a person. You know what I mean? Metal was a fantasy. Demons, Satan, the Dungeons and Dragons type mentality. And here these hardcore dudes were playing aggressive music like metal, but with lyrics that I could really get into. I was like, “Ok! This is me! I’m angry like these dudes." I identified with the Cro-Mags, with the tattoos and shit, cause I was just like them. So I got drawn into that—
J: So it was more real.
S: I was into the realness of hardcore back then. And then some trials and tribulations in my life took me out of that realm and put me into a prison environment. Before I went to jail, hardcore was always about family. And it really did feel like that to me. I come from a dysfunctional family, so my friends were my family, until I went to jail and then realized how fake people in hardcore really are. So I never really looked at hardcore the same when I got out. But I always liked hardcore as a ventilation because of the anger that you were able to express with it. In the 80s? I was definitely a hardcore fan. In the 90s? Not so much. I played hardcore shows, and did the whole hardcore thing, but I never was a dude who you would see, you know, dressing hardcore. I was always listening to rap, and still metal. If I knew your band personally, then I gave you that respect and I listened to your band. You know, like Madball, Merauder, mostly the New York bands, because they’re real dudes. Most of the other bands, I didn’t really care about, because I just thought they were fake and ranting and raving about nothing. Making up issues like being vegan, straight edge and this and that, which is a bunch of crap. It’s not an issue in life at all to me. But it is what it is, you know what I mean?
J: Yeah. So what do you think changed between the 80s and the 90s?
S: Well, I don’t think anything’s really changed. I think it’s exactly the same. It goes through spurts. Like when I first got into hardcore, it was really underground, and it grew fast and it got real popular. Then I went to jail and I came out and it was nothing. Then I started doing my bands, and then by like ’94 was a whole other rebirth around like ’95, ’96, ’97, it was just like, to me, like 80s hardcore. So now, in 2000, I don’t really… I don’t pay attention to hardcore at all, so I can’t even elaborate on it, but the shows that I’ve been to are wack. The fanbase is weird, it’s very feminized, you’ve got crews… not lately, but a couple years ago, crews going around just beating up on their fans and acting like savages towards people that are coming in and paying money… putting money in your pocket, more or less. Which never made sense to me. I know I sang for Fury of Five and we’re quote-unquote a “tough band,” but I never beat up on my fanbase. We beat up on people who were white power, or if somebody was just acting totally like an idiot. We weren’t going to shows savagely just looking to beat up somebody for no reason. Usually, when we beat somebody up, it was for a reason, or there was a good cause for it. But now, it’s different. In 2000, it went totally haywire. Fury of Five broke up in ’98, and I had my own trials and tribulations, and then this whole gang mentality arose and just dominated. It just—I think, really, from my perspective and what I’ve seen, it really killed the fanbase. People don’t come out like they used to. Not that I see, anyway. I don’t really go to that many shows.
J: Right, but from what you can tell, from the ones that you do go to.
S: From what I can tell—I mean, I go to sporadic shows here and there. Last year around Father’s Day, I went and saw H2O in the city with Stigma’s band, because all those dudes are friends of mine and I brought my son (he likes H2O). And I think Hazen St. was playing—he loves that band! So we took him out, me and his mother, we went over there and I got to see all the people I hadn’t seen in awhile. That was a good show. New York shows are always pretty good. Because they’re really tight knit—somebody just asked me that question, actually, “What’s the difference between New York hardcore and Jersey hardcore?” And the difference is, New York looks out for each other. If there’s a band member missing, they put a band member there. They keep it moving. In New Jersey? Yo, they just want to see you fall. Everybody else wants to be the top dog, even if they suck, and they’d rather see you suppressed and down than try to get your band out there. I always approach New Jersey with a New York attitude. Trying to keep it family, getting bands involved, putting people on my record because I was up and coming… But now, in 2010… The hate for me is crazy! But it doesn’t stop me, they couldn’t stop me if they wanted to [J laughs]. They can run their mouth on the internet, but come see me personally and it’s a different story. New York—their scene is always right and moving forward. Even if they have band beef, they still go forward —it progresses. That’s why it doesn’t die down. There hasn’t been a band from Jersey since Fury of Five that really made any progress. None! I can’t think of one. E-Town only got really big in New Jersey. They haven’t really gotten that popular out of New Jersey—I don’t want to say that their draw sucked out of state, but they didn’t have the fanbase that they have here. So, you know, New Jersey is wack, scenes are all wack everywhere—I don’t know about West Coast, I’ve never really been over there, but—
J: Yeah, but you kind of relate more to New York?
S: Yeah, I always, always have had much respect for New York hardcore. But I never claimed to be from there. I always put it down for Jersey. I always let it be known that I was from here, my band’s from here, this is where I rep. I was never that dude who was a dick rider, like a lot of these Jersey bands always like dick riding— for example, when Sick of It All was up and coming in the 80s and even the 90s, every freaking New Jersey band was trying to jock them, pretending to be NYHC. I would say, “If you don’t like me, I don’t like you either!” I’m not gonna suck your dick for shows or be your friend to try to better myself in life. If you can’t just be my friend, then I don’t need people. I’ll figure it out. I’m a man! [J and S laugh]
J: What do you think about the role of violence in hardcore? Why do you think it is, or at least was, such a prevalent thing?
S: You’re always gonna have violence when it comes to hardcore, a lot of young kids are looking for an identity—me, myself, when I was young, I was very angry. Pissed off. Some kids are pissed off for no reason, but for the most part, there is a reason most kids are drawn to hardcore. For ventilation, and violence will always play a part in it. Wherever there’s anger, there’s gonna be some sort of violence. The violence that just happened recently in the hardcore scene was a fabricated bunch of bullshit, really. None of these dudes are even tough. And one on one, I swear to god none of them would have a go. They’re jumping people. So the violence is a fabricated type of attack. It’s just like…trying to impress each other, you know? If I attack you in an angry fashion, it’s because you pissed me off for a reason! I’m not just gonna go attack you for no reason and just beat you up and then go drink a beer and laugh with my friends. My motives were always legit reasons. If I beat you up, it was for a reason. Or what I felt was a good reason. [S and J laugh] But just attacking somebody and then go celebrate with your friends and high fiving and shit--“Yo, we kicked his teeth out!” That shit is stupid to me. But there’s always gonna be violence where there’s anger. So if there’s a bunch of bands singing pissed off music and trying to give off that persona like they’re tough guys, it’s always gonna be like that. It’s been that way since I was into hardcore. I used to go to Cro-Mags shows, and the skinheads were beating up on the punk rockers. Or the metalheads. It’s always gonna be the stronger taking out the weaker, until the weaker stands up. I never understood why the crowd never united and fought back. Because it’s only a handful of dudes attacking people! So you take all this around that and attack back, and it’s eventually gonna stop.
J: Right, strength in numbers.
S: Exactly! But, you know, that one crew grew rapidly because it wasn’t a real crew, because a real crew will be more selective on who they let into a clique. They were just putting anybody down just to be known. It’s a big fallacy, just a bunch of wannabes. Where are all of them now? A lot of them denounced their letters and shit… just a bunch of crap. Even their special on TV was horrible. I was like, "Are these guys serious?" I saw their “beatdown” video. I saw them straight, totally sneaking people, and they wouldn’t even fall! Yo, if I sneak you, you hit the ground! I don’t care who you are. You’re gonna straight blast somebody, and they’re gonna look at you like you’re nuts, man? How do you put that on a DVD? I’m just saying.
J: Not that impressive?
S: No, it wasn’t. I was more embarrassed for them! When there’s no other tough guys around, you can get that off. So that’s why it manifested into what it was, because there were no legit people around to reprimand those type of dudes and control those dudes. Other crews were minimized. And this crew just put anybody down who—Yo, “You get a YCH tattoo and you’re in.” That’s retarded.
J: Do you think that most crews are like that?
S: No, I don’t think so. I’m part of a crew that’s nothing like that. I rep BFL, Brothers for Life. Most of these dudes I met when Fury first started back in like ’94. And they’re my friends for years now. These dudes are the most genuine, down to earth people that I ever met in my life. Do anything for you. I mean, they’ll stand their own—if you try to bring it to them, they’ll bring it right to you. But they don’t go out of their way—they don’t go out with this attitude like “we’re the shit, we’ll take over a club,” this and that. It’s not like that at all. It’s just a bunch of friends that hang out, and if something goes down, you bet your ass somebody’s gonna get served up. DMS too, the same way. They’re not like that, they do their own thing until somebody disrespects them. But when it comes to crews, there’s always gonna be violence also. Not all crews are that way, but they have violent tendencies if it has to be brought to that measure.
J: When you were talking before, you were saying that when you were involved in violence, it was usually for a reason, it wasn’t just for nothing. What were the reasons? Was there a lot of white power stuff going on in the 90s, or…?
S: When I first started going to shows, the white power thing was around for awhile, and then I got locked up and came out and it was kinda dominating in the early 90s. I had just got out of jail, and I had an attitude [S laughs] like no other, like a savage. It all started one time with some white power dudes in Point Pleasant, I brought it to like five of them and three skinhead girls. So it was eight against one, and I served these dudes (and girls) up like a savage. White power—racism has always been one of my reasons to bring it to you. You gonna walk around like that? I have a lot of multicultural friends. And you’re gonna come around here like that? Ain’t happening. You know, with your swastikas, and your crazy—Hitler shirts. It ain’t happening. I’ll bring it to you every time.
J: Did that happen a lot? Did a lot of people like that come to shows in the 90s?
S: Well, yeah, not—in the 2000s, I haven’t really seen it but I’m not really in that “realm,” so to speak. But up until the Fury breakup, there was mad times that we served up white power dudes. We beat up some white power dudes right in front of a music store over here in Woodbridge, served these dudes up. Always at the Stone Pony, white power dudes… they’ll come out, they ain’t scared.
J: Why do you think they keep coming out, if they keep getting beaten up?
S: You know why? I’m glad you asked that. I'm not saying this because I’m gonna take their side or condone it—it's because they really stand up for what they believe in. Like I posted something the other day: In three months, the Baghdad police killed... I think it was like 30,000 dogs.
J: Yeah, I saw that.
S: Killed them. Where were all the vegan and animal rights people protesting that? They’ll only protest when it accommodates them. That’s the difference between them and the white power dudes—they don’t give a fuck. They’ll take an ass whooping for their beliefs. Where a vegan person won’t do shit. They’re cowards. A white power dude will take his and come back next week and do it again. Because they’re devout about what they believe in, and they’ll keep on coming back. That’s why they don’t disappear. They believe that shit. You can’t knock em for that. It’s almost the same thing with the Muslim people, that’s why they kill themselves, that’s why they blow themselves up in the name of Allah. Because they’re devout. They believe that shit. The same thing with me when I was—back then, I was totally against that. I had a lot of Jewish friends, a lot of black friends, Puerto Rican friends. You can’t come in my house like that! So we’ll have to serve you up. That’s how we used to do it! [J and S laugh]
J: Well it seems like, nowadays, it doesn’t seem to be as big of a problem as it used to be. They still exist, but I mean, I personally never really run into them much at shows or anything.
Stickman: I got into hardcore around 1984. I was a crossover dude, you know, like a metalhead. I would go to metal shows, and they would have hardcore bands opening up like Sheer Terror, Ludachrist, Leeway, Cro-Mags, and… just seeing these bands, I would go home and research it, and I was really like, “Wow, I like this stuff!” It was how I felt as a person. You know what I mean? Metal was a fantasy. Demons, Satan, the Dungeons and Dragons type mentality. And here these hardcore dudes were playing aggressive music like metal, but with lyrics that I could really get into. I was like, “Ok! This is me! I’m angry like these dudes." I identified with the Cro-Mags, with the tattoos and shit, cause I was just like them. So I got drawn into that—
J: So it was more real.
S: I was into the realness of hardcore back then. And then some trials and tribulations in my life took me out of that realm and put me into a prison environment. Before I went to jail, hardcore was always about family. And it really did feel like that to me. I come from a dysfunctional family, so my friends were my family, until I went to jail and then realized how fake people in hardcore really are. So I never really looked at hardcore the same when I got out. But I always liked hardcore as a ventilation because of the anger that you were able to express with it. In the 80s? I was definitely a hardcore fan. In the 90s? Not so much. I played hardcore shows, and did the whole hardcore thing, but I never was a dude who you would see, you know, dressing hardcore. I was always listening to rap, and still metal. If I knew your band personally, then I gave you that respect and I listened to your band. You know, like Madball, Merauder, mostly the New York bands, because they’re real dudes. Most of the other bands, I didn’t really care about, because I just thought they were fake and ranting and raving about nothing. Making up issues like being vegan, straight edge and this and that, which is a bunch of crap. It’s not an issue in life at all to me. But it is what it is, you know what I mean?
J: Yeah. So what do you think changed between the 80s and the 90s?
S: Well, I don’t think anything’s really changed. I think it’s exactly the same. It goes through spurts. Like when I first got into hardcore, it was really underground, and it grew fast and it got real popular. Then I went to jail and I came out and it was nothing. Then I started doing my bands, and then by like ’94 was a whole other rebirth around like ’95, ’96, ’97, it was just like, to me, like 80s hardcore. So now, in 2000, I don’t really… I don’t pay attention to hardcore at all, so I can’t even elaborate on it, but the shows that I’ve been to are wack. The fanbase is weird, it’s very feminized, you’ve got crews… not lately, but a couple years ago, crews going around just beating up on their fans and acting like savages towards people that are coming in and paying money… putting money in your pocket, more or less. Which never made sense to me. I know I sang for Fury of Five and we’re quote-unquote a “tough band,” but I never beat up on my fanbase. We beat up on people who were white power, or if somebody was just acting totally like an idiot. We weren’t going to shows savagely just looking to beat up somebody for no reason. Usually, when we beat somebody up, it was for a reason, or there was a good cause for it. But now, it’s different. In 2000, it went totally haywire. Fury of Five broke up in ’98, and I had my own trials and tribulations, and then this whole gang mentality arose and just dominated. It just—I think, really, from my perspective and what I’ve seen, it really killed the fanbase. People don’t come out like they used to. Not that I see, anyway. I don’t really go to that many shows.
J: Right, but from what you can tell, from the ones that you do go to.
S: From what I can tell—I mean, I go to sporadic shows here and there. Last year around Father’s Day, I went and saw H2O in the city with Stigma’s band, because all those dudes are friends of mine and I brought my son (he likes H2O). And I think Hazen St. was playing—he loves that band! So we took him out, me and his mother, we went over there and I got to see all the people I hadn’t seen in awhile. That was a good show. New York shows are always pretty good. Because they’re really tight knit—somebody just asked me that question, actually, “What’s the difference between New York hardcore and Jersey hardcore?” And the difference is, New York looks out for each other. If there’s a band member missing, they put a band member there. They keep it moving. In New Jersey? Yo, they just want to see you fall. Everybody else wants to be the top dog, even if they suck, and they’d rather see you suppressed and down than try to get your band out there. I always approach New Jersey with a New York attitude. Trying to keep it family, getting bands involved, putting people on my record because I was up and coming… But now, in 2010… The hate for me is crazy! But it doesn’t stop me, they couldn’t stop me if they wanted to [J laughs]. They can run their mouth on the internet, but come see me personally and it’s a different story. New York—their scene is always right and moving forward. Even if they have band beef, they still go forward —it progresses. That’s why it doesn’t die down. There hasn’t been a band from Jersey since Fury of Five that really made any progress. None! I can’t think of one. E-Town only got really big in New Jersey. They haven’t really gotten that popular out of New Jersey—I don’t want to say that their draw sucked out of state, but they didn’t have the fanbase that they have here. So, you know, New Jersey is wack, scenes are all wack everywhere—I don’t know about West Coast, I’ve never really been over there, but—
J: Yeah, but you kind of relate more to New York?
S: Yeah, I always, always have had much respect for New York hardcore. But I never claimed to be from there. I always put it down for Jersey. I always let it be known that I was from here, my band’s from here, this is where I rep. I was never that dude who was a dick rider, like a lot of these Jersey bands always like dick riding— for example, when Sick of It All was up and coming in the 80s and even the 90s, every freaking New Jersey band was trying to jock them, pretending to be NYHC. I would say, “If you don’t like me, I don’t like you either!” I’m not gonna suck your dick for shows or be your friend to try to better myself in life. If you can’t just be my friend, then I don’t need people. I’ll figure it out. I’m a man! [J and S laugh]
J: What do you think about the role of violence in hardcore? Why do you think it is, or at least was, such a prevalent thing?
S: You’re always gonna have violence when it comes to hardcore, a lot of young kids are looking for an identity—me, myself, when I was young, I was very angry. Pissed off. Some kids are pissed off for no reason, but for the most part, there is a reason most kids are drawn to hardcore. For ventilation, and violence will always play a part in it. Wherever there’s anger, there’s gonna be some sort of violence. The violence that just happened recently in the hardcore scene was a fabricated bunch of bullshit, really. None of these dudes are even tough. And one on one, I swear to god none of them would have a go. They’re jumping people. So the violence is a fabricated type of attack. It’s just like…trying to impress each other, you know? If I attack you in an angry fashion, it’s because you pissed me off for a reason! I’m not just gonna go attack you for no reason and just beat you up and then go drink a beer and laugh with my friends. My motives were always legit reasons. If I beat you up, it was for a reason. Or what I felt was a good reason. [S and J laugh] But just attacking somebody and then go celebrate with your friends and high fiving and shit--“Yo, we kicked his teeth out!” That shit is stupid to me. But there’s always gonna be violence where there’s anger. So if there’s a bunch of bands singing pissed off music and trying to give off that persona like they’re tough guys, it’s always gonna be like that. It’s been that way since I was into hardcore. I used to go to Cro-Mags shows, and the skinheads were beating up on the punk rockers. Or the metalheads. It’s always gonna be the stronger taking out the weaker, until the weaker stands up. I never understood why the crowd never united and fought back. Because it’s only a handful of dudes attacking people! So you take all this around that and attack back, and it’s eventually gonna stop.
J: Right, strength in numbers.
S: Exactly! But, you know, that one crew grew rapidly because it wasn’t a real crew, because a real crew will be more selective on who they let into a clique. They were just putting anybody down just to be known. It’s a big fallacy, just a bunch of wannabes. Where are all of them now? A lot of them denounced their letters and shit… just a bunch of crap. Even their special on TV was horrible. I was like, "Are these guys serious?" I saw their “beatdown” video. I saw them straight, totally sneaking people, and they wouldn’t even fall! Yo, if I sneak you, you hit the ground! I don’t care who you are. You’re gonna straight blast somebody, and they’re gonna look at you like you’re nuts, man? How do you put that on a DVD? I’m just saying.
J: Not that impressive?
S: No, it wasn’t. I was more embarrassed for them! When there’s no other tough guys around, you can get that off. So that’s why it manifested into what it was, because there were no legit people around to reprimand those type of dudes and control those dudes. Other crews were minimized. And this crew just put anybody down who—Yo, “You get a YCH tattoo and you’re in.” That’s retarded.
J: Do you think that most crews are like that?
S: No, I don’t think so. I’m part of a crew that’s nothing like that. I rep BFL, Brothers for Life. Most of these dudes I met when Fury first started back in like ’94. And they’re my friends for years now. These dudes are the most genuine, down to earth people that I ever met in my life. Do anything for you. I mean, they’ll stand their own—if you try to bring it to them, they’ll bring it right to you. But they don’t go out of their way—they don’t go out with this attitude like “we’re the shit, we’ll take over a club,” this and that. It’s not like that at all. It’s just a bunch of friends that hang out, and if something goes down, you bet your ass somebody’s gonna get served up. DMS too, the same way. They’re not like that, they do their own thing until somebody disrespects them. But when it comes to crews, there’s always gonna be violence also. Not all crews are that way, but they have violent tendencies if it has to be brought to that measure.
J: When you were talking before, you were saying that when you were involved in violence, it was usually for a reason, it wasn’t just for nothing. What were the reasons? Was there a lot of white power stuff going on in the 90s, or…?
S: When I first started going to shows, the white power thing was around for awhile, and then I got locked up and came out and it was kinda dominating in the early 90s. I had just got out of jail, and I had an attitude [S laughs] like no other, like a savage. It all started one time with some white power dudes in Point Pleasant, I brought it to like five of them and three skinhead girls. So it was eight against one, and I served these dudes (and girls) up like a savage. White power—racism has always been one of my reasons to bring it to you. You gonna walk around like that? I have a lot of multicultural friends. And you’re gonna come around here like that? Ain’t happening. You know, with your swastikas, and your crazy—Hitler shirts. It ain’t happening. I’ll bring it to you every time.
J: Did that happen a lot? Did a lot of people like that come to shows in the 90s?
S: Well, yeah, not—in the 2000s, I haven’t really seen it but I’m not really in that “realm,” so to speak. But up until the Fury breakup, there was mad times that we served up white power dudes. We beat up some white power dudes right in front of a music store over here in Woodbridge, served these dudes up. Always at the Stone Pony, white power dudes… they’ll come out, they ain’t scared.
J: Why do you think they keep coming out, if they keep getting beaten up?
S: You know why? I’m glad you asked that. I'm not saying this because I’m gonna take their side or condone it—it's because they really stand up for what they believe in. Like I posted something the other day: In three months, the Baghdad police killed... I think it was like 30,000 dogs.
J: Yeah, I saw that.
S: Killed them. Where were all the vegan and animal rights people protesting that? They’ll only protest when it accommodates them. That’s the difference between them and the white power dudes—they don’t give a fuck. They’ll take an ass whooping for their beliefs. Where a vegan person won’t do shit. They’re cowards. A white power dude will take his and come back next week and do it again. Because they’re devout about what they believe in, and they’ll keep on coming back. That’s why they don’t disappear. They believe that shit. You can’t knock em for that. It’s almost the same thing with the Muslim people, that’s why they kill themselves, that’s why they blow themselves up in the name of Allah. Because they’re devout. They believe that shit. The same thing with me when I was—back then, I was totally against that. I had a lot of Jewish friends, a lot of black friends, Puerto Rican friends. You can’t come in my house like that! So we’ll have to serve you up. That’s how we used to do it! [J and S laugh]
J: Well it seems like, nowadays, it doesn’t seem to be as big of a problem as it used to be. They still exist, but I mean, I personally never really run into them much at shows or anything.
S: Yeah, they’ll come out, it depends on where you go and what band’s playing. There’s not that many bands that play that style of music that they like. Believe me, they’ll come incognito to hardcore shows, I’ve seen it many times. I’ve seen them at Hatebreed shows—I’ve even seen them at Fury shows back in the day. They’ll be singing along with—Jay Fury was Jewish! Crazy. Sometimes they’ll come to these surroundings because they have no choice. Where else can they go? Because they like aggression, too.
J: Yeah, so they’re also drawn to it.
S: --they’re drawn to that whole anger thing. They’re pissed off dudes, they just don’t like black people, or other races besides white. [J laughs]
J: I know you’ve toured a lot and been to a lot of different places over the years. Do you think that things are really different from city to city as far as hardcore goes, or is it mostly the same?
S: Oh, it’s definitely different. The closer you are to this area, the tri-state area—everywhere else, as you get further, the assimilation disintegrates. Like when I first started going to shows, I saw this dude Jay, he was from a band called Krakdown, and Gavin from the NY Hoods, and I would see these guys dancing, like, crazy. I would take that back to Jersey with me, go home and practice! [S and J laugh] That’s how it works. But sometimes, when you get too far out, it gets real different. Even in Europe, when I first went to Europe, I was like, wow! They wouldn’t even applaud for us. I’m used to coming to Stone Pony, anywhere on the East Coast, you know, first ring out, you get a response. These dudes were emotionless!
J: I thought you guys were kind of big in Europe?
S: Well, we were the second time. The first time, we went with Integrity, and they had their own crowd. This like, PC, on the verge of emo, you know—that weird, crazy—whatever he sings about. [J laughs] Dwid’s a good guy, I have no problems with that dude, he was really cool with me, but he’s a little shot out with his lyrics and whatever. And he had his own crowd, so we didn’t really fit in on that bill. The second time we went, with Pro Pain, it was phenomenal. They loved us. I just went there with Boxcutter in March, which was one of the greatest shows I ever played besides the Tsunami Fest. I was shocked at the amount of Fury of Five fans that were there. It was crazy. The band’s never been there—Boxcutter—ever, we were co-headlining with Skarhead, and the reaction we got—I’m still like, wow! I played many shows, but to be somewhere with a band for the first time ever and to get that response was overwhelming. Mad people wearing Fury of Five jerseys, t shirts, it was crazy. But hardcore’s different everywhere. Plus you got your extensions of the scene, you got your emo, straight edge, vegan… In the 80s, it wasn’t like that. Even though you had Youth of Today and your Bold and all these straight edge bands, they would play with the tough guy bands, and it would be like… a great show! I used to go to shows messed up on drugs and be singing Youth of Today songs. It was awesome! [S and J laugh] You can’t do that now, though, or they’ll probably beat you up if you come into there piss-drunk. I have been to straight edge shows tripping on acid, dusted out like crazy, and getting into it like bananas. But everybody was more family then, it was really a vibe of unity. In New York. But in New Jersey, it was not the same.
J: So was Jersey kind of always like you described? Kind of—not really much of a family vibe?
S: No, never. It still to this day is not a family vibe. It’s nothing. New Jersey scene has always sucked. I only rep Jersey because this is where I’m from. I’m proud of where I come from, and I’ll let people know that. But as a scene? It’s horrible. The strongest it was was when Fury was around. We made it that strong. It didn’t start off strong. We went out there and—I wrote the song Taking Respect, that’s exactly what we did. We went out there, and we put it in their face, we’re here to stay, and we ain’t going nowhere. And eventually—people came around, even people who didn’t like us in the beginning liked us in the end. Because we went out and we were consistent, and our heart was in it, and people saw that. That was the difference. Because the heart was there. We weren’t the best band, by far, but our attitude and just who we were, and the energy, and just—everything was there. I had old school dudes used to tell me, “Yo, you make me feel like I’m in the 80s right now!” When I used to go to CBGB’s, the Ritz, or even City Gardens at times, it could be a little scary in the club, and that's how we made the people feel when they came to see us.
J: What do you think about the new generation of Fury of Five fans? People who weren’t around when you guys played, but are still super obsessed with Fury of Five?
S: Know what the best thing for me was? I haven’t played in 12 years. First of all, let me just state that I caught a lot of flack for doing that show by myself, there’s a bunch of people saying that it wasn’t Fury of Five. But I gave them Fury of Five, from the crowd response—it was overwhelming to me to even get that 12 years later. A Fury fan is a different type of beast, because a Fury fan is an angry individual, for real. Because they’re relating to what I put into those songs. I put my heart into those songs. That anger that you hear in those songs? That’s authentic. And only real people can feel that! When I went to that show on June 12th, by myself, I didn’t even know what I was going to expect. It’s 12 years later, I don’t have an entourage with me, I got nobody there to set it off for me. I went there with my son’s mother and my son. He’s one of the main reasons I did it, because he wanted to see his dad onstage. I’m onstage with four dudes that I’ve never played with before (except for Mahmood, because he’s in Boxcutter). So I’m going up there, I don’t know what to expect, and the response to that show, from those people—and most of them had never even seen Fury of Five! It was the first time. It was the best Fury show I ever played, because… it was the true, true fans. People that love the music. And it was funny, because one day I was with my club, Last Gear, and we were chilling in New Brunswick, and a New Brunswick cop came out of a car—two of them—and I thought they were gonna harass us because of the bikes that were parked in a no parking zone. And the one dude was like “Yo, ask him!” And he was like, “Yo, aren’t you the singer from Fury of Five?” and I was like, “Yeah, no doubt! I thought you were gonna impound my bike!” And he was like, “Man, I got both of your records, you guys are my favorite band!” I said “Yeah, we’re playing a show.” He said, “Yeah, the Tsunami Fest, I can’t make it, I wish I could go. I've never seen you guys play” And it made me realize: some people have never even seen Fury of Five, they just like the music! That made me realize, wow, there’s a whole new generation that likes Fury of Five and has never even seen the band. Which is really, really cool for me because I used to have an entourage of people—like I said—everywhere I went, and dick riders, and none of those people were there, and that place went totally bananas. And you know, you—we were talking on BBM and you were telling me about this dude from Taste the Steel and I asked, remember? I said, “Well, if you were to talk to him, would he say he saw Fury Jam, or Fury of Five?” and you told me, he said he definitely saw Fury of Five. That’s great, that I came back 12 years later and gave those fans—
J: --what they wanted.
S: Some people said I couldn’t do it, but I did it. I think I did it, anyway. No matter what some of the internet gangsters are talking. My son, the other day, he was like “Daddy, I’m mad!” I’m like, “Why?” I go pick up my son, he’s wearing a Fury of Five shirt and a Boxcutter hat! [J and S laugh] Loves his dad. Him seeing his dad onstage was one of the best things that ever happened for me, because that kid, he always loved me, but now he loves me! [J and S laugh] He thinks I’m somebody special and not just a loser! [J laughs] He’s like, “Daddy, yo, if this dude was here right now, I think I’d punch him!” I said, “Why!” He said, “He was talking crap about you!” I said, “Me?!” He said, “Yeah, he said Fury of Five at Tsunami Fest was the silliest thing that he’s ever seen.”
J: Who is this?
S: Some dude on the internet. My son’s got the little I-Touch, and he’ll go on there and look up Fury of Five or Boxcutter, and I guess he came across some review, some interview that Mike Terror—from Fury of Five did, like two years ago. I was like wow, I didn’t even know this dude did interviews. Those guys don’t really converse with me, so… it is what it is. But it was kind of funny, my kid wanted to punch somebody in the face for talking crap about it. He’s like, “Was that guy even there?” I said, “I don’t know, what did you see?” He goes, “I don’t know, but it was awesome!”
J: I think it’s good that you have that kind of attitude about the whole thing, though. Because I know that a lot of people would see the new fans as not being as “legit” since they weren’t there the first time around. I think it’s cool that you still appreciate that.
S: I have always been one for the fans, because I don’t feel like I’m any different than anyone in the crowd. I don’t go hide in the backroom, I don’t go pretending like I’m some kind of rockstar. I’m just a person. I use that type of music for venting my anger. At that time. I’m not as angry as I used to be, I get angry, but not like that. I was really mad back then. I was a time bomb just waiting to explode. But I’ve always been for the fans, always. I’ll give my shirt off my back if they need it. That’s the kind of person I am. That’s why Fury of Five got so much respect, and that’s why people don’t care who’s in the band as long as I’m in it. Because I went to Europe—and no disrespect to any of the members of Fury of Five—I was in Boxcutter, I wasn’t in Fury of Five, and there were mad Fury of Five fans out there… And at that show and at Tsunami Fest, nobody asked about any original members. And from the videos that I’ve seen from being onstage and witnessing what I saw, those people that were there—everybody was singing along, everybody was having good time, there was no fights. And everybody left seeing Fury of Five. I delivered that. So it doesn’t matter who’s behind me. I did that for the fans, too. These guys, I don’t know why they don’t want to play. It’s this whole issue—holding me accountable for things that happened between a 12 year span, that’s their bad. I was an asshole back then. It’s 12 years later. You’re still gonna hold that over my head? I don’t get it. People are retarded. And I haven’t changed. I’ve mellowed out, but I’m still the same dude. They’re the ones that changed, that’s why they feel that way. They don’t care about the fans. People are begging for a Fury of Five reunion. You’d think they’d come off their high horse and like—“let’s do it one time for old time’s sake.”
J: Put aside your differences?
S: Exactly! I offer them money, they say no. I go to do it on my own, they get mad. I can’t win! And my son’s been asking for years, “Dad, when am I ever gonna see you onstage?” And Boxcutter to me is cool, I love Boxcutter, I enjoy doing it, I love the rapping and the little bit of screaming, but Fury of Five was my shit. I can do that blindfolded. And that’s what I wanted my son to see. I wanted him to see his dad doing what he used to do. It would be cool to do Boxcutter, I did a song with him, but I wanted him to see what the real fans are—what I created from nothing.
J: What was his reaction?
S: He couldn’t stop saying to his mother—me and his mother are great friends—he goes, “Ma, I can’t believe it’s my Dad!” He kept on saying that over and over, “Wow, that’s my dad!” And then, “Why is everybody jumping on him?” [J and S laugh] Ever since that show, he’s been totally, totally like a different kid towards me. Like everything’s Fury of Five or Boxcutter, he’s trying to rap, he’s trying to write songs now, it’s great, you know what I mean?
J: Yeah, I’m glad you got to do that for him.
S: Oh, man, and when he came out and did his rap—which was incredible! He did it a capella. Because Boxcutter was supposed to play, I was supposed to bring him to Europe and his mother screwed me over on that, and—I wasn’t gonna let the opportunity pass without that kid coming out on stage. I was gonna have him try to sing a Fury song with me, I was gonna have him do Taking Respect, but there were too many pausey parts in there. It was a long song. So the day of the show, I’m like “Jordan. This is what you’re doing. You’re coming out on stage, and you’re gonna say, “Yo dad, let me tell these wanksters what time it is!” And I said, “I want you to go into your rap.” And so he did. At first I thought he was gonna choke--I was like oh my god! His mother was like, “I thought he wasn’t gonna do it!” Because he came out, and he had the mic, he grabbed the mic and he put his head down. I was like oh, no! He’s not gonna do it! And he looked up, and he goes, “Yo!” and he just started rapping and it was great. I never taught him stage presence or nothing. He was pointing at the crowd, and the best part of the whole thing was the one part where he goes, “J Rock is illin’, Iz is illin’,” when he said, “Iz is illin’,” he pointed at me! [J laughs] I was like ohhh! Shoot! And then when I saw the video that his mom had, he was high fiving with the kids... the crowd was singing with him, yo it’s great. I wish I could be that kid. Because it must have been an awesome feeling to be onstage in front of all those people with your dad, singing a song that you did with your dad. That’s awesome.
J: Are you planning on doing any more shows going forward, since that went so well?
S: I don’t want to say yes and I don’t want to say no, because I’m at a point now where... it’s possible. I just gotta see how things are, because I have responsibilities and I can’t just pack up and tour. It’s different for me now. I’ve got a truck payment, rent, dog, motorcycles... I have a life now. When I did Fury, I had no life but Fury. Fury was everything that I had. That’s why I tell my son all the time, I say, “Don’t put all your eggs in one basket. If you’re gonna follow your dream, make sure you have a backup plan.” But yeah, I don’t know if I could just pack up and go. The only thing that really motivates me to want to do it is the people talking shit. As long as they talk shit, I’m gonna prove you wrong every time. The more the haters are talking about “that’s not the real Fury of Five,” this and that, just made me just want to prove them wrong even more. I didn’t even want to have to make statements on the Hardcore Website, but I had to because mother fuckers were running their mouths so much. You got something to say to me, come to my face, man. You have to go and... because you have a little bit of fanbase, or some idiot that follows you around because they don’t know better, and you’re gonna run your mouth--I don’t get it.
J: Did anyone approach you and say anything about it, or was it all just internet stuff?
S: Nobody’s ever approached me. I had gotten direct messaged and, I thought I still have it saved on the computer somewhere, but if I was to post that, next to what he’d be saying on there, it would make him look stupid. At the end of the day, they come off hard, and in the end it was, “oh, I hope you have a good show, man...” These dudes just hating for no reason. They don’t want me to come back because they lose credibility. That’s the whole thing. I bring the truth wherever I go, so you’re gonna look like a liar in certain aspects of your life. Because 12 years is a long time to build up the right story. And then if I come back, your story might not look the same anymore. They’re trying to keep me on the back burner, but nobody’s gonna keep me down except for myself. And most of them weren’t even in it. If you were in the band, then you can say what you want. You’re telling me I all do the lyrics, I'm some freaking dude screaming over music, somebody else wrote, please--I can bring a thousand witnesses on how a song got written for Fury of Five. So... it is what it is.
J: Why did you wait 12 years to finally play a show?
S: Well, I never really wouldn't have played another show, to be honest with you. I felt like the rest of them--I didn’t want to do it without the originals. And I still wouldn’t, I really don’t sometimes, that’s why I don’t really pursue it like I should. There was a certain attitude that came with that band, but when I went to Europe with Boxcutter, on the way back, me and Mahmood were talking and he’s like, “Yo, we gotta do a Fury show, bro.” And I tried to explain to him, that’s a different kind of animal, man. A lot of attitude went into that band. I don’t even feel like the same dude. I don’t want to bring that to the people if it isn’t what it was. Because if I’m not the same dude and I don’t feel that way, I feel like it wouldn’t come off the same way. I said, “What if we just do one song on a Boxcutter set? Do like Every Man for Himself or something?” And he was like alright, we’ll do that. He called me up like a week later and he’s like, “Yo, give me five--give me six songs you wanna do!” Dude, for what? He was like, “We’re doing a Fury Jam!” I said what do you mean a Fury Jam? He said, “Yo, I got this, bro. We’re gonna do Fury Jam at Tsunami Fest.” I said man, you out your freaking mind! He said, “I’m telling you, bro, I got this. Just trust me, and we’re gonna do it.” And so I have to give all the credit to Chris Mahmood, because he put it all together. And now, we’ve always been friends, but now we’re like real family now--he even told me, he said, “You’re like a real brother to me.” I’ve shown him a lot of stuff, and we bonded, and we talked, and he can do Fury right now. That’s the kind of dude he is. He’s got that attitude. But it was all him, it had nothing really to do with me. I already knew that stuff. That whole band had to learn that shit, I knew it. But yeah, all credit goes to him. I don’t take no credit for putting it together. Like I said, I didn’t even feel comfortable doing it without original members, but when I got around these dudes and they were playing, I thought, this ain’t that bad! Would I say that show was 100% Fury? Nah, but it was pretty damn close. Everybody there thought it was. I’m not saying that because I don’t want to be disrespectful to the other members that played in this band. But these people failed to realize that--this was coming for a long time. Better--skilled musicians come along. They just think that they’re not replaceable. But everybody’s replaceable. Except for me, of course. [J and S laugh]
J: Of course!
S: I had my own distinct style, see? If you have a style that’s yours, nobody can really duplicate it. Who’s gonna sing for Fury of Five and be respected? And am I gonna let you sing my lyrics? I’ll be at every one of your shows with a baseball bat in my mother fucking hand, you ain't gonna sing my songs. You wanna take those songs and put different lyrics to them? Go right ahead, but ain’t nobody singing my lyrics. I guarantee that I will be at every show with a baseball bat.
J: I doubt anyone would try that, though.
S: You never know, because that’s how people are. They like to push the limits. You can never say never. I don’t ever doubt a hater. I don’t underestimate a hater either, because they’re crazy.
J: Yeah, so they’re also drawn to it.
S: --they’re drawn to that whole anger thing. They’re pissed off dudes, they just don’t like black people, or other races besides white. [J laughs]
J: I know you’ve toured a lot and been to a lot of different places over the years. Do you think that things are really different from city to city as far as hardcore goes, or is it mostly the same?
S: Oh, it’s definitely different. The closer you are to this area, the tri-state area—everywhere else, as you get further, the assimilation disintegrates. Like when I first started going to shows, I saw this dude Jay, he was from a band called Krakdown, and Gavin from the NY Hoods, and I would see these guys dancing, like, crazy. I would take that back to Jersey with me, go home and practice! [S and J laugh] That’s how it works. But sometimes, when you get too far out, it gets real different. Even in Europe, when I first went to Europe, I was like, wow! They wouldn’t even applaud for us. I’m used to coming to Stone Pony, anywhere on the East Coast, you know, first ring out, you get a response. These dudes were emotionless!
J: I thought you guys were kind of big in Europe?
S: Well, we were the second time. The first time, we went with Integrity, and they had their own crowd. This like, PC, on the verge of emo, you know—that weird, crazy—whatever he sings about. [J laughs] Dwid’s a good guy, I have no problems with that dude, he was really cool with me, but he’s a little shot out with his lyrics and whatever. And he had his own crowd, so we didn’t really fit in on that bill. The second time we went, with Pro Pain, it was phenomenal. They loved us. I just went there with Boxcutter in March, which was one of the greatest shows I ever played besides the Tsunami Fest. I was shocked at the amount of Fury of Five fans that were there. It was crazy. The band’s never been there—Boxcutter—ever, we were co-headlining with Skarhead, and the reaction we got—I’m still like, wow! I played many shows, but to be somewhere with a band for the first time ever and to get that response was overwhelming. Mad people wearing Fury of Five jerseys, t shirts, it was crazy. But hardcore’s different everywhere. Plus you got your extensions of the scene, you got your emo, straight edge, vegan… In the 80s, it wasn’t like that. Even though you had Youth of Today and your Bold and all these straight edge bands, they would play with the tough guy bands, and it would be like… a great show! I used to go to shows messed up on drugs and be singing Youth of Today songs. It was awesome! [S and J laugh] You can’t do that now, though, or they’ll probably beat you up if you come into there piss-drunk. I have been to straight edge shows tripping on acid, dusted out like crazy, and getting into it like bananas. But everybody was more family then, it was really a vibe of unity. In New York. But in New Jersey, it was not the same.
J: So was Jersey kind of always like you described? Kind of—not really much of a family vibe?
S: No, never. It still to this day is not a family vibe. It’s nothing. New Jersey scene has always sucked. I only rep Jersey because this is where I’m from. I’m proud of where I come from, and I’ll let people know that. But as a scene? It’s horrible. The strongest it was was when Fury was around. We made it that strong. It didn’t start off strong. We went out there and—I wrote the song Taking Respect, that’s exactly what we did. We went out there, and we put it in their face, we’re here to stay, and we ain’t going nowhere. And eventually—people came around, even people who didn’t like us in the beginning liked us in the end. Because we went out and we were consistent, and our heart was in it, and people saw that. That was the difference. Because the heart was there. We weren’t the best band, by far, but our attitude and just who we were, and the energy, and just—everything was there. I had old school dudes used to tell me, “Yo, you make me feel like I’m in the 80s right now!” When I used to go to CBGB’s, the Ritz, or even City Gardens at times, it could be a little scary in the club, and that's how we made the people feel when they came to see us.
J: What do you think about the new generation of Fury of Five fans? People who weren’t around when you guys played, but are still super obsessed with Fury of Five?
S: Know what the best thing for me was? I haven’t played in 12 years. First of all, let me just state that I caught a lot of flack for doing that show by myself, there’s a bunch of people saying that it wasn’t Fury of Five. But I gave them Fury of Five, from the crowd response—it was overwhelming to me to even get that 12 years later. A Fury fan is a different type of beast, because a Fury fan is an angry individual, for real. Because they’re relating to what I put into those songs. I put my heart into those songs. That anger that you hear in those songs? That’s authentic. And only real people can feel that! When I went to that show on June 12th, by myself, I didn’t even know what I was going to expect. It’s 12 years later, I don’t have an entourage with me, I got nobody there to set it off for me. I went there with my son’s mother and my son. He’s one of the main reasons I did it, because he wanted to see his dad onstage. I’m onstage with four dudes that I’ve never played with before (except for Mahmood, because he’s in Boxcutter). So I’m going up there, I don’t know what to expect, and the response to that show, from those people—and most of them had never even seen Fury of Five! It was the first time. It was the best Fury show I ever played, because… it was the true, true fans. People that love the music. And it was funny, because one day I was with my club, Last Gear, and we were chilling in New Brunswick, and a New Brunswick cop came out of a car—two of them—and I thought they were gonna harass us because of the bikes that were parked in a no parking zone. And the one dude was like “Yo, ask him!” And he was like, “Yo, aren’t you the singer from Fury of Five?” and I was like, “Yeah, no doubt! I thought you were gonna impound my bike!” And he was like, “Man, I got both of your records, you guys are my favorite band!” I said “Yeah, we’re playing a show.” He said, “Yeah, the Tsunami Fest, I can’t make it, I wish I could go. I've never seen you guys play” And it made me realize: some people have never even seen Fury of Five, they just like the music! That made me realize, wow, there’s a whole new generation that likes Fury of Five and has never even seen the band. Which is really, really cool for me because I used to have an entourage of people—like I said—everywhere I went, and dick riders, and none of those people were there, and that place went totally bananas. And you know, you—we were talking on BBM and you were telling me about this dude from Taste the Steel and I asked, remember? I said, “Well, if you were to talk to him, would he say he saw Fury Jam, or Fury of Five?” and you told me, he said he definitely saw Fury of Five. That’s great, that I came back 12 years later and gave those fans—
J: --what they wanted.
S: Some people said I couldn’t do it, but I did it. I think I did it, anyway. No matter what some of the internet gangsters are talking. My son, the other day, he was like “Daddy, I’m mad!” I’m like, “Why?” I go pick up my son, he’s wearing a Fury of Five shirt and a Boxcutter hat! [J and S laugh] Loves his dad. Him seeing his dad onstage was one of the best things that ever happened for me, because that kid, he always loved me, but now he loves me! [J and S laugh] He thinks I’m somebody special and not just a loser! [J laughs] He’s like, “Daddy, yo, if this dude was here right now, I think I’d punch him!” I said, “Why!” He said, “He was talking crap about you!” I said, “Me?!” He said, “Yeah, he said Fury of Five at Tsunami Fest was the silliest thing that he’s ever seen.”
J: Who is this?
S: Some dude on the internet. My son’s got the little I-Touch, and he’ll go on there and look up Fury of Five or Boxcutter, and I guess he came across some review, some interview that Mike Terror—from Fury of Five did, like two years ago. I was like wow, I didn’t even know this dude did interviews. Those guys don’t really converse with me, so… it is what it is. But it was kind of funny, my kid wanted to punch somebody in the face for talking crap about it. He’s like, “Was that guy even there?” I said, “I don’t know, what did you see?” He goes, “I don’t know, but it was awesome!”
J: I think it’s good that you have that kind of attitude about the whole thing, though. Because I know that a lot of people would see the new fans as not being as “legit” since they weren’t there the first time around. I think it’s cool that you still appreciate that.
S: I have always been one for the fans, because I don’t feel like I’m any different than anyone in the crowd. I don’t go hide in the backroom, I don’t go pretending like I’m some kind of rockstar. I’m just a person. I use that type of music for venting my anger. At that time. I’m not as angry as I used to be, I get angry, but not like that. I was really mad back then. I was a time bomb just waiting to explode. But I’ve always been for the fans, always. I’ll give my shirt off my back if they need it. That’s the kind of person I am. That’s why Fury of Five got so much respect, and that’s why people don’t care who’s in the band as long as I’m in it. Because I went to Europe—and no disrespect to any of the members of Fury of Five—I was in Boxcutter, I wasn’t in Fury of Five, and there were mad Fury of Five fans out there… And at that show and at Tsunami Fest, nobody asked about any original members. And from the videos that I’ve seen from being onstage and witnessing what I saw, those people that were there—everybody was singing along, everybody was having good time, there was no fights. And everybody left seeing Fury of Five. I delivered that. So it doesn’t matter who’s behind me. I did that for the fans, too. These guys, I don’t know why they don’t want to play. It’s this whole issue—holding me accountable for things that happened between a 12 year span, that’s their bad. I was an asshole back then. It’s 12 years later. You’re still gonna hold that over my head? I don’t get it. People are retarded. And I haven’t changed. I’ve mellowed out, but I’m still the same dude. They’re the ones that changed, that’s why they feel that way. They don’t care about the fans. People are begging for a Fury of Five reunion. You’d think they’d come off their high horse and like—“let’s do it one time for old time’s sake.”
J: Put aside your differences?
S: Exactly! I offer them money, they say no. I go to do it on my own, they get mad. I can’t win! And my son’s been asking for years, “Dad, when am I ever gonna see you onstage?” And Boxcutter to me is cool, I love Boxcutter, I enjoy doing it, I love the rapping and the little bit of screaming, but Fury of Five was my shit. I can do that blindfolded. And that’s what I wanted my son to see. I wanted him to see his dad doing what he used to do. It would be cool to do Boxcutter, I did a song with him, but I wanted him to see what the real fans are—what I created from nothing.
J: What was his reaction?
S: He couldn’t stop saying to his mother—me and his mother are great friends—he goes, “Ma, I can’t believe it’s my Dad!” He kept on saying that over and over, “Wow, that’s my dad!” And then, “Why is everybody jumping on him?” [J and S laugh] Ever since that show, he’s been totally, totally like a different kid towards me. Like everything’s Fury of Five or Boxcutter, he’s trying to rap, he’s trying to write songs now, it’s great, you know what I mean?
J: Yeah, I’m glad you got to do that for him.
S: Oh, man, and when he came out and did his rap—which was incredible! He did it a capella. Because Boxcutter was supposed to play, I was supposed to bring him to Europe and his mother screwed me over on that, and—I wasn’t gonna let the opportunity pass without that kid coming out on stage. I was gonna have him try to sing a Fury song with me, I was gonna have him do Taking Respect, but there were too many pausey parts in there. It was a long song. So the day of the show, I’m like “Jordan. This is what you’re doing. You’re coming out on stage, and you’re gonna say, “Yo dad, let me tell these wanksters what time it is!” And I said, “I want you to go into your rap.” And so he did. At first I thought he was gonna choke--I was like oh my god! His mother was like, “I thought he wasn’t gonna do it!” Because he came out, and he had the mic, he grabbed the mic and he put his head down. I was like oh, no! He’s not gonna do it! And he looked up, and he goes, “Yo!” and he just started rapping and it was great. I never taught him stage presence or nothing. He was pointing at the crowd, and the best part of the whole thing was the one part where he goes, “J Rock is illin’, Iz is illin’,” when he said, “Iz is illin’,” he pointed at me! [J laughs] I was like ohhh! Shoot! And then when I saw the video that his mom had, he was high fiving with the kids... the crowd was singing with him, yo it’s great. I wish I could be that kid. Because it must have been an awesome feeling to be onstage in front of all those people with your dad, singing a song that you did with your dad. That’s awesome.
J: Are you planning on doing any more shows going forward, since that went so well?
S: I don’t want to say yes and I don’t want to say no, because I’m at a point now where... it’s possible. I just gotta see how things are, because I have responsibilities and I can’t just pack up and tour. It’s different for me now. I’ve got a truck payment, rent, dog, motorcycles... I have a life now. When I did Fury, I had no life but Fury. Fury was everything that I had. That’s why I tell my son all the time, I say, “Don’t put all your eggs in one basket. If you’re gonna follow your dream, make sure you have a backup plan.” But yeah, I don’t know if I could just pack up and go. The only thing that really motivates me to want to do it is the people talking shit. As long as they talk shit, I’m gonna prove you wrong every time. The more the haters are talking about “that’s not the real Fury of Five,” this and that, just made me just want to prove them wrong even more. I didn’t even want to have to make statements on the Hardcore Website, but I had to because mother fuckers were running their mouths so much. You got something to say to me, come to my face, man. You have to go and... because you have a little bit of fanbase, or some idiot that follows you around because they don’t know better, and you’re gonna run your mouth--I don’t get it.
J: Did anyone approach you and say anything about it, or was it all just internet stuff?
S: Nobody’s ever approached me. I had gotten direct messaged and, I thought I still have it saved on the computer somewhere, but if I was to post that, next to what he’d be saying on there, it would make him look stupid. At the end of the day, they come off hard, and in the end it was, “oh, I hope you have a good show, man...” These dudes just hating for no reason. They don’t want me to come back because they lose credibility. That’s the whole thing. I bring the truth wherever I go, so you’re gonna look like a liar in certain aspects of your life. Because 12 years is a long time to build up the right story. And then if I come back, your story might not look the same anymore. They’re trying to keep me on the back burner, but nobody’s gonna keep me down except for myself. And most of them weren’t even in it. If you were in the band, then you can say what you want. You’re telling me I all do the lyrics, I'm some freaking dude screaming over music, somebody else wrote, please--I can bring a thousand witnesses on how a song got written for Fury of Five. So... it is what it is.
J: Why did you wait 12 years to finally play a show?
S: Well, I never really wouldn't have played another show, to be honest with you. I felt like the rest of them--I didn’t want to do it without the originals. And I still wouldn’t, I really don’t sometimes, that’s why I don’t really pursue it like I should. There was a certain attitude that came with that band, but when I went to Europe with Boxcutter, on the way back, me and Mahmood were talking and he’s like, “Yo, we gotta do a Fury show, bro.” And I tried to explain to him, that’s a different kind of animal, man. A lot of attitude went into that band. I don’t even feel like the same dude. I don’t want to bring that to the people if it isn’t what it was. Because if I’m not the same dude and I don’t feel that way, I feel like it wouldn’t come off the same way. I said, “What if we just do one song on a Boxcutter set? Do like Every Man for Himself or something?” And he was like alright, we’ll do that. He called me up like a week later and he’s like, “Yo, give me five--give me six songs you wanna do!” Dude, for what? He was like, “We’re doing a Fury Jam!” I said what do you mean a Fury Jam? He said, “Yo, I got this, bro. We’re gonna do Fury Jam at Tsunami Fest.” I said man, you out your freaking mind! He said, “I’m telling you, bro, I got this. Just trust me, and we’re gonna do it.” And so I have to give all the credit to Chris Mahmood, because he put it all together. And now, we’ve always been friends, but now we’re like real family now--he even told me, he said, “You’re like a real brother to me.” I’ve shown him a lot of stuff, and we bonded, and we talked, and he can do Fury right now. That’s the kind of dude he is. He’s got that attitude. But it was all him, it had nothing really to do with me. I already knew that stuff. That whole band had to learn that shit, I knew it. But yeah, all credit goes to him. I don’t take no credit for putting it together. Like I said, I didn’t even feel comfortable doing it without original members, but when I got around these dudes and they were playing, I thought, this ain’t that bad! Would I say that show was 100% Fury? Nah, but it was pretty damn close. Everybody there thought it was. I’m not saying that because I don’t want to be disrespectful to the other members that played in this band. But these people failed to realize that--this was coming for a long time. Better--skilled musicians come along. They just think that they’re not replaceable. But everybody’s replaceable. Except for me, of course. [J and S laugh]
J: Of course!
S: I had my own distinct style, see? If you have a style that’s yours, nobody can really duplicate it. Who’s gonna sing for Fury of Five and be respected? And am I gonna let you sing my lyrics? I’ll be at every one of your shows with a baseball bat in my mother fucking hand, you ain't gonna sing my songs. You wanna take those songs and put different lyrics to them? Go right ahead, but ain’t nobody singing my lyrics. I guarantee that I will be at every show with a baseball bat.
J: I doubt anyone would try that, though.
S: You never know, because that’s how people are. They like to push the limits. You can never say never. I don’t ever doubt a hater. I don’t underestimate a hater either, because they’re crazy.
tell it like it is james.
ReplyDeleteGood stuff!
ReplyDeleteI'm not the a real big hardcore fab, but I like music and the history behind it. This was fascinating stuff. Good job
ReplyDeleteI like the way this blog is starting..
ReplyDelete